Plato, Laws 641d

διατριβὴν ὡς εἰς παιδείας μεγάλην μοῖραν τείνουσαν λέγειν, ἂν ὀρθῶς γίγνηται. τί μήν; ἔχοις ἂν οὖν τὸ μετὰ τοῦτʼ εἰπεῖν ὡς ἔστιν τὸ νῦν εἰρημένον ἀληθές; τὸ μὲν ἀληθές, ὦ ξένε, διισχυρίζεσθαι ταῦτα οὕτως ἔχειν, πολλῶν ἀμφισβητούντων, θεοῦ· εἰ δʼ ὅπῃ ἐμοὶ φαίνεται δεῖ λέγειν, οὐδεὶς φθόνος, ἐπείπερ ὡρμήκαμέν γε τοὺς λόγους περὶ νόμων καὶ πολιτείας ποιεῖσθαι τὰ νῦν. τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ δὴ πειρώμεθα, τὸ σοὶ δοκοῦν περὶ τῶν

when rightly conducted, is an important element in education. Assuredly. Could you then show us, in the next place, how this statement is true? The truth of my statement, which is disputed by many, it is for God to assert; but I am quite ready to give, if required, my own opinion, now that we have, in fact, embarked on a discussion of laws and constitutions. Well, it is precisely your opinion